User talk:Toughpigs
Why did you delete the links? Hi Danny, can you tell me why u delete the links on International Sesame Street? Is there an other page where I can put a link to my website? Or is it for an other reason? -- Pino (talk) 01:52, 8 December 2006 (CET insomnia Argh -- I can't sleep! See you in 18 hours! — Scott (talk) 05:53, 8 December 2006 (UTC) Play With Me, Sesame Characters? Hey, Danny! Do you know if there were ever any Muppet pigeons on Play With Me Sesame? I just created a page for Juega Conmigo, Sésamo (Spain), a dub which premiered this fall, and the cast list I found for it mentioned two birds (which Babelfish translates as "dove," but in context, more likely means pigeon). Also a few other names like "Shirley" and "Guido" for which I can think of absolutely no logical Muppet counterpart. It reminded me of the Italian dub with names we couldn't match, like "Bingo Rock." Which would be a pretty good name for a Muppet at that. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 03:38, 8 December 2006 (UTC) :The only real characters in PWMS were Bert, Ernie, Grover and Prairie Dawn, at least in the first season. Any other characters who would need to be dubbed are from the inserts. So those names could be a bunch of things -- random puppets from an insert, animated characters from an insert, even inserts from the original Spanish version of Sesame. "Davey and Guido" might be Joey and Davey Monkey -- if they're being dubbed, then one person could conceivably perform both voices. So I think your use of question marks is reasonable, for now. -- Danny (talk) 03:44, 8 December 2006 (UTC) ::Right. I was asking if there were any new pigeons, but I assume not then. The package does seem to be a mix of multiple seasons (since it includes Ernestine, for example). Guido isn't Davey since we already have a Joey. I'm also amused by "Small Pencil" (Lapiz Miniscula), which is probably from a cartoon or other insert, but that they recorded who voiced him. And yeah, I'd noticed we'd used question marks on Sesamo Apriti, and this seemed like a parallel case. I also stumbled on a cast list for Barrio Sesamo, but that one's harder, not just because of possible redubs, but because it aired in both Castilian and Caatalan, so there were two seperate casts, and I haven't been able to untangle them. I *have * found the cast to the Quebecois Canadian dub, pre Sesame Park, which thanks to your CTW research, we know have premiere dates for and title, Bonjour, Sesame. Ain't multiculturalism grand? -- Andrew Leal (talk) 03:48, 8 December 2006 (UTC) :::You're a genius. Unfortunately, you happen to be a genius about subjects that are completely retarded, so you aren't recognized as well as you might otherwise be. -- Danny (talk) 03:51, 8 December 2006 (UTC) ::::Harrumph. Sir, I consider your remarks to be inimical to good fellowship. Plus the fact that outside of my Muppet endeavours, I am in fact presently engaged on potentially ground breaking work involving the mixed motives behind the National Film Board of Canada's depictions and "collaborations" with Inuit artists, suitable for both anination conferences and Native studies journals. So there. (Which is not to say that the treatment of multiculturalism and such in the academy is not subject to fits of "retardation," as you so crudely call it, but it *is* recognized.) :) -- Andrew Leal (talk) 03:54, 8 December 2006 (UTC) :::::No, no, man. I'm talking about what we're doing here, scrutinizing the cast lists for Spanish Play With Me Sesame (you) and inventing increasingly complex systems for keeping track of which episode a random insert appeared in (me). I intend nothing but good fellowship. We are both geniuses and we are both retarded, and that's why we've become friends. -- Danny (talk) 04:01, 8 December 2006 (UTC) ::::::True enough. I'm just intoxicated with the haze which comes of cold combined with cold medicine combined with doing Wiki work because I don't feel like stressing over what to put into another brilliant final paper right now. Plus I can't resist any opportunity to use the phrase "inimical." -- Andrew Leal (talk) 04:04, 8 December 2006 (UTC) Get my email? If not, just so you know, I got your package. Juicy stuff, I must say. Thanks! --MuppetVJ 04:16, 7 December 2006 (UTC) Main Page Whoah, can we talk about that before moving it? I think the problem is that Google hasn't indexed us yet. I was going to do some sleuthing on that soon to find out why. I think it should stay at Muppet Wiki. — Scott (talk) 19:39, 2 December 2006 (UTC) :Okay, sorry. That was rash, I guess. I was just googling "Muppet Wiki", and I was frustrated to see that they're still indexing us at "Main Page". I didn't realize that it was possible to do sleuthing. I'll move it back. -- Danny (talk) 19:53, 2 December 2006 (UTC) ::I think we moved it for all the right reasons. Our page rank is only 5/10 at Main Page versus 2/10 at Muppet Wiki (which I did watch go up from zero over a couple of months). It occured to me that Wikia may still be broadcasting Main Page instead of Muppet Wiki and that might be holding us back with Google. Also, every place I've submitted the links to over the past few months are pointing to Muppet Wiki. I would have just done muppet.wikia.com, but I was hoping to crush the old Main Page links that were out in the blogosphere. ::I'm busy off-and-on today, but when I get some time to focus on something, I'll be digging deeper on this. — Scott (talk) 20:00, 2 December 2006 (UTC) Sesame Street Live Wow. Poring through the bios, credits, and images from your archive visit is amazing. I'm actually mildly disappointed there's no suit performer cast list for Sesame Jambaoree, mostly because I've found some unexpected discoveries in the cast of A Sesame Street Mystery: The Case of the Missing Rara Avis, mostly the presence of actual Broadway people. Both voice and suit performer for Phineas T. Barnswallow were supplied by Grenoldo Frazier, who played Barnaby in the Pearl Bailey version of Hello Dolly, composed a musical about Moms Mabley, appeared as a day player on One Life to Live, and most relevant to us, his bio (not from the archives) states that he provided singing vocals on "Disco D." Roger Kachel, who played the walk-around Ernie, was on Cats on Broadway for decades, mostly as Mungojerrie, and also toured as a Ninja Turtle. And finally, Buz Suraci, the additional puppeteer from The Muppet Movie who was deleted since we couldn't find out anything else about him, played Oscar and a constable! Apparently he was/is a Washington D.C. native. So there you go. Most of this may not matter to you, but I found it pretty darn interesting, I suppose partially since I'd tended to assume that nearly all Sesame Street Live performers were roller derby refugees or just slightly higher on the theater scale than the poor kids in suits at Disneyland. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 22:44, 1 December 2006 (UTC) :Oh, that's fantastic. The thing that excited me about distributing those pages to everybody was that I knew we would each find different parts interesting. If I'd kept that to myself, I'd never have bothered to look closely at that stuff. I'm so glad that you're finding cool treasures in it! :I'm already planning for what I want to look at on my next visit... Box #2 has the entire run of the CTW newsletter, and Boxes #21 and 25 have correspondence with Jim Henson and the Muppet Show folks. So: Yay. -- Danny (talk) 22:53, 1 December 2006 (UTC) ::I just made another odd little find, this book, Feathers of Color: What Was it Like Playing the Famous Bigbird, "An American Icon. Seriously. Lionel Douglass, who played Big Bird in the first four Sesame Live tours, and has also been Danny Glover's stand-in in movies, wrote a book about the experience. I'm honestly not quite sure how to classify it. Oh, and Douglass'IMDb page includes a photo of him half-in the bird suit. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 23:01, 1 December 2006 (UTC) :::That's fantastic! What an odd thing. We can have a page for that -- it can go in Non-fiction Books. Lovely. -- Danny (talk) 23:35, 1 December 2006 (UTC) ::::Yay! And I just howled with laughter at the title suggestions. I so need to turn that into a page. I think Wait for Wadooo and Don't Be a Loser are my favorites. Looks like the Sesame Street Pitch Reel's depiction of the process actually wasn't all that far off! -- Andrew Leal (talk) 23:40, 1 December 2006 (UTC) Fatawhatever Hey, what's the "still stumping" issue on Talk:Fatatatita? From the discussion, it looked like Scott had figured it out, and the talkbox was just as a heads up. Unless the stumper is why the Count has two pets with eerily similar and hard to spell names. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 19:07, 1 December 2006 (UTC) :No, that question is unresolved. The article is about the Count's cat, but the extra names given may apply to the bats. Somebody needs to do whatever research is needed to tease out which name is used for which animal, and we'll have to create another article for the bat. -- Danny (talk) 19:11, 1 December 2006 (UTC) ::Oh, okay. You or I should probably add that, then, since it's not obvious (or wasn't to me) from the talk page. Scott's statement seemed to imply that Ftatatteetet whatever, with more ts, was clearly the bat, as leader of a musical group. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 19:13, 1 December 2006 (UTC) Farscape Connections Boy, Farscape is fertile ground for actor mining. In addition to adding a couple more connections to Superman (thanks to Superman Returns) and with several to go in to Star Wars as well, I just added Nicholas Hammond, who connects to The Sound of Music, Spider-Man, The Love Boat, and General Hospital, to name a few, and I plan to add Nick Tate later (Star Trek, Lost, and Sherlock Holmes, plus tons of voice work). -- Andrew Leal (talk) 23:01, 30 November 2006 (UTC) :Oh, fabulous! I love them soap opera connections. -- Danny (talk) 23:01, 30 November 2006 (UTC) ::I know you do, though my favorite in that department may well be Florence Stanley as the sobbing voice of Josette's ghost on Dark Shadows. Turns out Sesame Street and Dark Shadows shared a costumer for a while too. Though sadly, Mr. Hooper never wound up in sinister Victorian garb while Barnabas went around in a bowtie and suspenders. A missed opportunity there. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 23:04, 30 November 2006 (UTC) :::Did I know about the Josette thing? Dark Shadows is one of my favorite shows. Have we discussed this already? -- Danny (talk) 23:06, 30 November 2006 (UTC) ::::No, but I've seen your E-bay auctions. :) I haven't seen as much as I'd like (I was kept pretty sheltered from horror stuff as a youth), but I find it pretty darn fascinating. I like Grayson Hall, Jonathan Frid, and boy was that show an almost permanent berth for actors, even for a soap opera. No worries about being killed or written off, you were practically guaranteed to come back at some point as a ghost/zombie/ancestor/alternate time descendant/insane count/roaming gypsy etc. And it seems Bil Baird operated the puppet bat. How neat is that? If only Count von Count ever referenced Collinsworth, and we'd have a pretty nice connections page. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 23:18, 30 November 2006 (UTC) :::::That's Collinwood, babe. I'll have to start getting you to watch the DVDs. :) The show was only on for five years, and it was only good for about three years, so you can actually watch the whole thing, or everything that's worth watching, without it being a lifetime project. It's one of my very favorite shows. If the whole point of television is to show you surprising things (and it is), then Dark Shadows is one of the best uses of television ever. :::::There's an unbelievable episode where the second half of the show is an evil warlock putting the most loveable heroine on an altar and doing a black mass over her so that he can claim her soul, marry her and live with her eternally in Hell. This is an absolutely absurd thing to put on television for ten reasons -- the most salient being that the show was on at 4:30 in the afternoon, and it was very popular among school children. So you just watch the episode, and you think, holy crap. And this was 1968. There was a popular religious tract in circulation at the time called "Satan's Favorite TV Show", and it's kind of hard to argue with the sentiment. :::::And then on top of that, it had an incredibly appealing cast, acting out complicated plots on beautiful sets with an amusingly shoestring budget. It's a fantastic show. If you're interested in trying it, I can tell you which DVD to rent. -- Danny (talk) 02:32, 1 December 2006 (UTC) :::::::I might do that. I caught a few on SciFi years ago (only had cable three times in my life, and anyway, The Twilight Zone was my SciFi meat). And I've read a fair amount about the history, and especially the year switchings, which seem pretty intriguing to me. My parents were pretty strict, so horror was a no no as a kid. I still don't go for the gore, but I'm rather fond of the various permutations of it ca. 1930s-late 1960s (maybe a smidgen of 70s stuff, like Vincent Price's Dr. Phibes). I'm particularly a sucker for the Universal Wolf Man and Invisible Man films (and not solely because Abbott and Costello met them, though that helps). Re Dark Shadows, I vaguely remember Dr. Julia Thingummy treating Barnabus, having obviously fallen for him, and the Josette/Angelique thing, and oh yes, the two werewolves (I *think* there were only two, Quentin and Whassname), but that's about it. And apparently Abe Vigoda was in two episode. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 02:43, 1 December 2006 (UTC) ::::::::Yeah, there isn't any gore in DS; just weirdness. The best place to start is with the first flashback, when they go to 1796 and you see how Barnabas became a vampire. That's when the show suddenly kicked up into really high gear. And yeah, there were two werewolves, a bunch of different vampires, some witches, some ghosts, a Jekyll/Hyde doctor, a Frankenstein's monster, gypsies, immortals, H.P. Lovecraft critters, zombies, evil preachers, a living hand in a box with magic powers, a stairway through time, a room that exists in two dimensions, seances, exorcisms, black masses, and two hit records. Plus everybody falls in love with each other. Craziest shit you ever saw. -- Danny (talk) 02:56, 1 December 2006 (UTC) Mildred Huxtetter Look at Filmography and tell me what you think. I'm still tweaking. — Scott (talk) 21:20, 30 November 2006 (UTC) :I'm not sure I can see what the difference is. It looks the same-ish to me. -- Danny (talk) 22:48, 30 November 2006 (UTC) ::Purge your cache and you should see it. If not, you might have to wait a while. It took some time to show up in certain browsers for me. — Scott (talk) 23:04, 30 November 2006 (UTC) :::Oh, I see it now! That's fantastic! Who woulda known. That's really nice. -- Danny (talk) 23:08, 30 November 2006 (UTC) Grandmama Bear Final paper season is here, and busy trying to scratch out six more pages, but taking a Wiki break, I noticed this passage: "Baby Bear confronts her, and convinces her that he's not a little baby anymore. Finally seeing her grandson as the big boy that he's become, Grandmama Bear takes him bowling." That's hilarious. I love the logic of that. And adding to the wacky relatives, here's the unseen Uncle Stan from Dinosaurs. One of these days, as long as we have a half a dozen relative pages, I need to add in the various dino relatives. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 01:43, 30 November 2006 (UTC) :Yeah, it's a funny ending to that episode. There's a very sentimental moment, where Baby Bear says that even though he's a big boy, he still likes getting hugs. So she hugs him, and then says, "Okay, let's go bowling." :And Uncle Stan is awesome -- I hadn't noticed the Grandpa Louie page before, too. I like the bit about the pipe. It would be cool to do a whole Sinclair family tree at some point. -- Danny (talk) 02:28, 30 November 2006 (UTC) ::By the way, check out Episode 3979 for I.M. Pig. Fantastic. -- Danny (talk) 02:30, 30 November 2006 (UTC) G is for Growing Hey, I noticed Tony added some episode numbers for E&B sketches based on Sesame Street and the Reform of Children's Television ... have you gone through G is for Growing yet? I was tempted to buy it again, but I already did that once — Scott (talk) 16:36, 27 November 2006 (UTC) :"G is for Growing" is an okay book, but not as good as the "Reform" book; "G" is more for education majors about research, but there are some episode numbers and titles, but none of the sketches referenced to are linked to them (though an interesting bit of info: the "Imagination" sketch from the 1970s with Ernie and Bert originally had Ernie scared of monsters, but it tested poorly. The sketch was "retired", and remade into a version where Ernie has a nightmare instead). "Reform" is a lot better; it mentions the "Mad Painter" series, Jim's "Baker" films being criticized for its violence, and the citation page specifically lists what segments came from what show. The good stuff is under the "Itty-Bitty, Little-Kiddy Show" chapter. -- MuppetDude 16:41, 27 November 2006 (UTC) ::Yeah, there's some interesting stuff in G is for Growing, especially the chapter about the magazine. I was picking some stuff to take from it, but then I got sidetracked by, y'know, everything else. I'm sending you a CD of the archive scans tomorrow -- do you want me to send the book too? -- Danny (talk) 00:23, 29 November 2006 (UTC) Antonio I don't know if the character deserves his own page (his appearance in Episode 0276 is obscured by Rafael, so I can't get a good screen grab), but Antonio was played by Panchito Gomez, and surprisingly, as evidenced by a YouTube clip of a Season 3 credits set, was actually billed. Yet poor John-John always got stiffed. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 23:32, 26 November 2006 (UTC) :Oh, I didn't know that; how exciting. Yeah, make him a page, if you feel like it. He gets a nice shout-out from Luis in episode 0300. -- Danny (talk) 23:34, 26 November 2006 (UTC) ::I don't know what to say about him. I just thought I'd let you know, in case you have any more details on him in your archive materials. And apparently Sesame Street doesn't do much for the kids, since both Gomez and Carlo Alban played a lot of drug addicts and Latino gang members and such in later years. Better than doing so in real life, undoubtedly, but still, what would Bob say? -- Andrew Leal (talk) 23:37, 26 November 2006 (UTC) Sir John Feelgood! I'm glad you finally found info on this guy. Between him, Ronnie Trash, and Cyranose de Bergerac, seems like Jerry Nelson got all the parody roles. Is Lady Agatha a character from the "Mysterious Theater" sketches, by the way? I seem to vaguel recall her. Next time, for either you or me if I go, it's worth looking into when those aired. Warrick's old Sesame Encyclopedia said 1991, some Muppet Central lists say 1989, and I notice that Watson appeared in a book from 1986 (though in that case, I suspect the print doggie came first, and they just kept the name when they added the text). Less than 55 articles to go, so while I'll still be adding stuff, with more than a week left, I'll be focusing more on papers (as I should) and other Wiki stuff (gathering info and images to beef up a few of the rather sad Writers pages). Oh, and if you haven't seen it, I hope the text on Mo Momo amuses you (and Scott added the brilliant Moby). All in all, it's a glorious time on the Wiki. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 20:13, 24 November 2006 (UTC) :Yeah, I like how this goal is pushing us to find interesting new articles to add. Mo Momo and Moby are both wonderful. You should go ahead and work on your papers, I think it's now a done deal that we're going to reach and exceed 12k by December 5th. :It's hard to say whether you could go to the archives and find any particular piece of information. It's more like a grab bag -- you just reach your hand in, and see what you pull out. I think you have to just enjoy the unpredictability of it, knowing that you'll find amazing things, whether that happens to be the things you were looking for or not. -- Danny (talk) 20:23, 24 November 2006 (UTC) ::Oh yeah. Hmmm. I'm trying to figure out my grad school apps, or even whether to apply for the Phd or just wait a year. I've heard things about the University of Maryland's program. I should check on that, though I'm inclined to think if I don't do it in Syracuse, I'd rather go somewhere warmer (or, I should see what conferences are being hosted at University of Maryland in the near future; since if I successfully submit a paper, the department will pay my way). -- Andrew Leal (talk) 20:26, 24 November 2006 (UTC) Danny's talk archive *Muppet Wiki Talk Archives